Thursday, 6 December 2007

Talking to the dead

Cole was a very nice former uni-mate of mind. We became quite close in our final year in London due to our common interest in… cooking. Through my conversation with him, found out that he comes from a family where the father is a former high priest who used to practise black magic. He once told me that monks coming from Thailand will go visit his father whenever they are in town. Cool huh...

But things became ugly one day when the spirits that his father ‘kept’ turned against the family. I would love to share the story, which is an exciting one. But out of respect for Cole, I can only conclude that the unfortunate incident led to the whole family becoming Christians. Sorry guys, there are just some things which I just shouldn’t write about.

Anyway, Cole has a brother called James, and they are very close. And I mean… very close. The bond between them is very strong. Unfortunately, James died a tragic death when Cole was still in his teens. It was classified as murder but the police never solved the case. Well, it’s our beloved police so…

Stuck in between his new found faith in Christ and the desire to know how James died, Cole went back to the ways his father used to practise. He went to look for a medium in his quest to talk to the dead… to talk to his brother… to talk to James… he went ‘man mai’ (directly translated as ‘ask rice’)…

This phenomenon is quite a freaky thing, one which my Mom told me she has been to a few times. You will go to the medium with the name, date of birth, time of birth, date of death, time of death and other relevant information of the person you want to speak to and it is believed that the medium will travel to the underworld to look for that person, usually a relative. Once found, the medium will allow the dead to possess the medium’s body and the seeker can then talk to the dead through the medium.

So Cole went to see the medium and after giving her (yes, it’s usually an old lady) the relevant information, she performed the ritual and true enough, she found James from the underworld and let James possess her body… and talk to Cole.

This is how Cole described the experience…

~~Zewt, it was just so real. Suddenly, you wonder if Christianity is real. She (the medium) was a lady but she could talk exactly like James. She even spoke in James’ voice! And she suddenly will sit the way James sat. It was really like I was talking to James. Just that ‘he’ appeared in the form of the medium, who was an old lady~~

The medium could speak like the dead… act like the dead and… possessed the voice of the dead, one which the medium has not heard before. Cole then told me that the medium could tell of the place James died, and the sequence of events which led to his death… what he did that day… all accurately described according to Cole’s knowledge. It was truly an amazing thing.

One very peculiar thing though… the information which Cole seeks most… “the person responsible for James’ death”… that information was never revealed. “James” just said he passed out and did not know what happened next.

Regardless of whether Cole achieved his objective or not, would you consider such medium as fake? Would you think that everything was just a show? It will make one ask oneself about life and death isn’t it?

Though Cole never discovered who the real killer was, he actually went back to the medium several times, just to speak to ‘James’ as Cole misses him very much. Cole wanted to talk to his brother. The love for his brother supersedes his faith.

Interesting isn’t it? For Christian readers… how do we explain all this?

This is the part where Zewt, being a Christian will explain how that is possible based on his knowledge. You will most probably find it outrages. But then again, isn’t what you read already outrages?

Christians believe that evil spirits roam the earth freely. These are minions of satan, former angels who rebelled against God with satan a former chief angel himself. Their job is to make sure you don’t believe in Christ. And since these evil spirits are former angels, they do possess some form of power.

So when Cole spoke to “James” through the medium, it is not James. It is one of the spirits who has been following Cole and James all these while, who knows how they grew up, who knows how they live their life, one who possesses power to change voice, or other things within its means. It is such spirit who took over the medium’s body.

Plainly said, consider that spirit Cole’s guardian devil, one placed with him since his birth to screw up his life. But Cole is not alone. You and I have one too.

Outrages isn’t it? Not quite. If you have read books from this author called
Rebecca Brown, it’s 10 times more outrages. And as for us, we can only rely on our faith to discern between what is right and what is wrong.

65 comments:

sooi2 said...

ok, it's a bad idea to read this at 1 in the morning. thanks for the goosebumps!! :p

angel said...

Like that also can?? Memang outrageous woh... but... The Truth Is Out There! :P

Maxforce said...

This the one explanation which I find truly depends on what one believes - lets just say its true, not that I am saying it is - that there is only one God and others are Satans or Minions of Satan or whatever.

And so there is always the explanation whereby only Christian God is the true God, bla bla. Others are Satans or minions of Satans - therefore got power.

Sounds logical. And may indeed appeal to many logical minds.

Here's this question where none could answer so far besides the faith answer - How do you know which is which? Which is the real God and which is Satan or whatever minions? Hah! :P

Explored many religions actually. In the end, well, I am a free thinker. None could explain themselves. (I usually use the same religion's context to ask questions) :P

whisperingshout said...

There is a word for the meeting - seance.

There were incidents whereby the BUDDHIST relatives of deceased CHRISTIAN went to hold seance. They managed to 'talk'. Quite easy to test this theory if you have passing friends/relatives of different faith :P

No logical conclusion. We just have to accept the illogicality of religion. The more we question logically, the more faith we lose, regardless of which religion we believe in.

kyh said...

Each religion has its own interpretation on these supernatural talks.

Abrahamic faiths (Judaism, Christianity, Islam) all regard spirits as evil beings which are manifestations of Satan to diverge men from the true path.

In Indic religions (Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism etc), we hold a different view. Spirits can be good or evil, depending on the characteristics the dead person has when he's still alive. If a person dies a terrible death or other related incidents, he'll hold a grudge and that will manifest him into an evil spirit. But that doesn't mean that this evil spirit will need to be casted away or expelled forever. Buddha had dedicated Himself in preaching and teaching these spirits that holding vengeance will only make matters worse as well as brings harm to oneself, and they will never get their problems solved. Those who have been enlightened by His teachings will join His realm in becoming one of the countless Buddha's protector spirit.

And I don't know whether u've seen photos with unexplainable circular orbs like objects scattered throughout the photo before or not. Check out this link: http://www.maxgreinerart.com/AngelOrbs.html

It's a Christian explanation on spirits (in the forms of orbs) appearing in photos. And in Buddhism, the protector spirits of Buddha will all appear in the form of orbs when being captured in photos. In Buddhist sacred sites like the place where He's born and reached enlightenment, millions of these spirits are all over the site. You can actually spot millions of these orbs in a picture taken there. The more sacred the place is, the more protector spirits will be. I've personally taken pics which hv orbs on it b4 too. People who reject any form of religions will tend to make up an explanation from science even though there's no scientific validity in it. They just don't want to believe it's a supernatural thing that appears on the photos. Ha!

Rashikaps said...

This stuff gives me the heebie-jeebies. Heard lots of stories about spirits, good and evil, to know they exist. But it remains an un-proved concept.

Think I told you about this set of books by Dr. Brian Weiss. Read 'Many Lives Many Masters' first. You'll like it.

Dan-yel said...

Oh I used to be very curious about supernatural when I was a kid. Since then I have grown detached from the realm of the supernatural.

Anyway, the reason for the detachment? 2 words; Discovery Channel! (later Wikipedia)

Most of the magic or miracles, supernatural, if you may, I watched, were fishy the very least.

For example with the medium, with her vast experience she could just throw up general statements and then go slowly to more specific ones to impress her customers, at the same time observe your body language to validate how true my statement was and then move on to expand that "true" part of the statement. The fact that, all the time, she refused to tell who the murderer is suggests that she is incapable of going anymore specific.

For example, say I'm talking in front of you, and I'm a MP wannabe. I tried to convince you that I know your problems,so my speech would go like this;

"People, I know that you had enough. You want change!"
you will start listening
"You are angry with the increase in tolls, the Chinese are taking away your money, the Indians try to create riot"
Then I observe which of the three problems receives the most reaction from you, like widening your shoulder, movement of ur lips. Say you do that when I said "Chinese..." I'll talk more about that, being the insincere politician I am.

And you see, you may not give a damn about toll increase, is just like a passing-by statement, that may not attract skepticism.

A similar technique might have been used by the medium or some hocus-pocus witch who claim to be able to read minds. I see them as playing with the language and observing closely their customers' body language (much to the oblivion of the customer) and then proceed with the aim of impressing them, as opposed to provide them answers.

:) just a piece of my thought

Dan-yel said...

para 4 ...to validate how true her statement...

PrincessJournals said...

I wud like to reply to kyh's comment. actually in Islam, not all spirits are evil. we acknowledge the existence of the spirits or jins and tht there are 2types of them. as we muslim malay call them, jin Islam and not.

Either way, we are not to asscociate ourselves with them as they are still of diff form. and when we need help, regardless of wht religion we believe in, we should only ask/seek fr god. ;)

Zewt, on ur recent posts, i really enjoy reading them. I dont want to personally experience them but i like reading/watching abt them and stories abt medium and such ppl.

kyh said...

^ dan-yel,

so how do you explain "She (the medium) was a lady but she could talk exactly like James. She even spoke in James’ voice!" when the lady haven't even met James before?

Dan-yel said...

Anyway, in response to kyh, truths that any religion postulates are supposed to be self-evident. With that in mind, I hope kyh is open to the possibility that some of this supernatural may not be true, and there are reasons to suspect that all these stories are produced in a desperate attempt to reinforce their communities' faith.

Don't get me wrong, I'm open to the possibility that they're might be spirits, roaming in the world, but your tone especially at the last sentence suggests that you are holding on to it as absolute truth. Not only is this kind of attitude wrong, it will be damaging to your faith, and you'll find yourself in self-denial to make up for whatever untruths you came across.

We choose to compare the ideals and philosophy behind every religion so as to appreciate the diversity of the representation of truth. To hinge your faith on a supernatural occurrence is misleading, for I infer from your last statement, the validity of which rests heavily on whether such phenomena happened or not.

Those who came up with scientific explanations are people who seeks to find the truth in the most sincere manner by providing alternative explanations which are then left to the scientific community and the world at large to judge. Ah, the wonders of democracy :)

Dan-yel said...

For your info kyh, my prev comment was to your December 6, 2007 2:54 AM comment

Dan-yel said...

Kindly take note kyh, I'm merely providing my opinion and alternative explanation, and I'm leaving to the rest to decide. As to your question kindly take note that she could put forward a general question that can cover many incidences of murder, and there is a possibility, I think, that this would be the case in a practical sense

Dan-yel said...

December 6, 2007 4:12 AM
we should choose...

December 6, 2007 4:15 AM
what i meant was, there's a chance that she could pull it off by putting forward general statements. Then go ahead into specifics, it's like you knock a wall, there and there, to find a solid portion for you to nail it

Sorry for not checking my comments, and being too lazy to simplify my statements :)

Sunshine said...

thats freaky, every religion has its own explanation on this supernatural stuffs, i will respect your beliefs, but would not dwell further...

rachel said...

i am sorry but i dont believe this man mai thing... i just feel that, u kno, when we lose some one we feel sad and all that, so we need some kinda comforting and we found it in this 'man mai' thing. i think its jus something we human came up with to make handling death a lil easier... and zewt, enough of creepy entries already...

myop101 said...

haha... so we read the same book(s) from the same author.

as a christian, we must always remember this: man is appointed to live once and then to judgement (Hebrews 9:27). and in the story of rich man and lazarus, this Abraham clearly explained to this rich man why the dead rich man can't even go to the living and warn his brothers unless they too end up in hell (Luke 16:19-31).

is it possible for a spirit to rise from the dead to speak to us? i seriously doubt it.

Sharon said...

interesting piece, though i hope you'd blog more bout what happened to Cole's family and how they all became Christians.

simply said, dont play with fire or you'll just end up burning urself

Mcmercedez said...

Well, 'mun mai' is something I myself can't explain.. I went once with my mum and my aunties to 'mun mai' when I was very young to talk to my grandma and grandpa and I just sat there and kept quiet and the medium could actually call my name as what my grandma and grandpa used to call me.. hm.. I really wonder on this..

But in your friend's case, he would actually could not get the answer from the brother coz as I know, the dead could not say who have caused their dead.. In taoism, the dead are actually barred from saying who have caused their dead but only could give hints.. And also it's not good to keep calling them up from the underworld as it will cause the soul to keep worrying about their loved ones and will not be in peace.

As a Christian, I do believe that there are guardian angels who are following us around to help us when we're in need.

Everything that we do or how long we gonna live, it's actually have been planned by God. In cantonese, 'sek kei tor, cheok kei tor, hai cheng teng jor ke le'. Every episode in our life has already been planned by God and all we need to do is to cherish every moment of it and thank God for that.

missironic said...

creepy wei! lolz..but sumhow alwiz reminds me of those comedy chinese movies where they ask those mediums to be possessed just to find their loved ones on the other side..in those movies, its not scary coz its stupidly funny..so i guess i wont have nitemare tonite la. lolz...

i tink to noe abt tis life n death ting..one will only noe of the real story once we r dead already. so i tink, wait till we pass on first la then the truth shall be revealed! lolz...

Huei said...

well..there are real and fake man mai people, the one cole met was probably real, who knows, i mean, in my point of view at least

but there's one thing for sure, it's not being in denial, it's just, if it makes you happier believing that you can finally talk to the dead, the one u once so loved, the one you're desperate to talk to again, why not?

The Pisces Man said...

Eh, why lately your blog becomes so 'dark' laaa...?

may said...

let sleeping dogs lie. and that includes spirits...

ahjohn said...

In reply to MAXFORCE:-

I understand that you are a free thinker. And you posted the sentence, "Which is the real God and which is Satan or whatever minions?"

Seriously have you ever consider if there is life after death or you have never made any research on all religions before you become an Atheist.

If you put all religions together, many religions are actually worshipping to a certain man/woman. I do not want to go to any religion in specific. But if you look into the history of these men, 1. they are actually great warriors or 2. someone who practice good way of living or 3. myth with non existance/proof (forms of animals or skull or cartoon character).

You can list all the gods together and try to check out.
Which of these men have actually proclaim that they are God? We all know the consequence of wrongly claiming that. Most of them are ppl claiming that they are, but actually they did not claim themselves to be.
Go do your reseach.

Give you a hint:-
John 8:24.
“Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

now you go, interesting eh?

aSstHa said...

i actually don't believe in all this mumbo jumbo but d biggest impact on my life made me question my earlier predicaments. (i'm a freethinker btw much to my mother's dislike)

i lost a dear fren early this year and it was so sudden none of us cud come to accept it (i think zewt already knows wat i'm talking abt)...

at one point my another fren was commenting does she know that she's dead? cos it all happened so suddenly that sometimes she might not be aware that she's dead. if that was the case she'd prolly be raising all heaven n hell to come back n settle her unresolved issues. i passed it of as jz a comment and didn't give another thought to it.

two days after that, i got a call from another fren who also knew that departed fren n tellin me an ex-colleague (not very close to our fren) said that she thinks our fren is tryin to make contact with her (i've never shared this with anyone btw)... we thought she was out of her mind (she's christian btw)...

apparently my fren's soul is not at ease and somehow knew this ex-coll cud help her. i ignored her msgs that whole nite cos as it is i was emotionally drained and didn't want to make myself hope that somehow she was telling the truth. in the end she managed to locate the husband's cousin.

they went to her place n her uncle did the seance thingy (he was more intuned wit his spiritual side n she ignored it for the most of her life until dat day). i wasn't allowed to sit in n neither was her husband. she only wanted to talk to the husband's cousin who was somesort her childhood fren.

at the end of it the conclusion (yes, i was given the conclusion). she said she didn't want to go but 2 men in white came to take her. n her unresolved issues were the benefitiaries to her insurance policy was not named and she wanted it to go to her kids n not her husband/parents. n she wanted the cousin to take care of her kids as her own.

i tot that whole ordeal was behind me and i could grieve my loss of a close fren in private. that wasn't the end. somehow a childhood fren of hers was in india and he was only informed after a week of her passing by her husband's cousin sister. he did wat everyone else did and googled it n chanced upon my blog and contacted me.

he went to see amma who so happened to be in india at that time (she travels quite frequently)... a hindu devotee or somesort i can't remember now. and she told him that she had to take her away for she would not hv found happiness in this life and she would cause another's life grief. wen he told me that (via phone from india) i got goosebumps all over. cos watever i heard from my ex-coll and this fren was like 2 pieces of a puzzle. i never told him abt the seance.

it really got me to question wat i think is hocus pocus n wat is real. this incident has rendered me completely lost. too many coincidences... too many things that jz fell into place n i was right smack in the centre of it.

i don't know wat u guys want to think about this. i hv never told anyone actually. only those who i saw knows wat happened. n each of them only had their piece of d puzzle. i never told them the other half i knew. somehow, i guess it was meant to be that way. probably for me to find out all this was a form of my own healing from losing her.

as i said, wen she was alive i knew her as a fren, sister n confidant. wen she left, i got to know her as a person.

btw, if u're thinking the seance we were talking to her it was not done that way. the uncle held some sort of pendulum thingy and instructed that if yes then sway to right if no then no movement. the sway to the right was a very solid right, no swinging back n forth... as told to me by the cousin. my ex-coll said once the uncle sent her into the light (her hindu, them christians ya) she felt like a heavy burden was lifted from her shoulders like she was at peace. like she could feel watever my fren was feeling. mind u, we were not being charged for any of this... it was a favour cos my ex-coll jz couldn't shake of the feeling. so i really do not know wat to believe n i'm sharing this today that sometimes, if we search for the answers we end up complicating things even more at times like these, i guess it's just best we accept things as it is.

i definately didn't want to contact her, but somehow or other... *sigh*... sorry... memories... sorry zewt for takin up so much space

tulipspeaks said...

reading the post + comments alone in a deserted campus is not a good idea!

:(



ammu.

Jacss said...

huh..yr interest...cooking ar, not blogging?

it's such an interesting story(keep it coming...hehe), i don't quite believe in "man mai" too!!

and your/'the christian' way of explaning it is quite acceptable to me who is not of the same religion.....

Manal said...

Reminded me of the movie "Ghost" starring patrick swayze, demi moore and whoopi goldberg. Oda Mae Brown (whoopi) was the reluctant medium who helped Molly (demi) to unveil the real story behind Sam (patrick)'s murder.

Any white light, zewt? or should we interrogate achmed-the dead terrorist again? I've been watching that videoclips over and over again!

j or ji said...

Masa aku berumur 10 tahun,aku pernah ikut orang jumpa bomoh perempuan yang sama macam jalan cerita ni...sungguh real...bertukar suara jadi lelaki..garau...

aku tergamam.

sekarang...sudah besar...aku tak tau nak percaya atau tidak.Tapi semua tu boleh terjadi dan tidak pelik.

alan zed said...

hurm, interesting.

pablopabla said...

Coming from the same faith as you, I understand what you mean and am trying to say.

The spirit world is real and there is no doubt about it. The question which each person need to ask oneself is : why would you want to dabble in the spirit world especially to speak to the "deceased"? If you do so, chances are you will be trapped and not have the peace in the heart which can only come from God. Such practices can become addictive and can be destructive. Even movies show that those who dabble in the spirit world don't experience peace.

sharlydia said...

never knew u have the interest in cooking though! haha... jules gonna have the priviledge to enjoy ur cooking now...

gracieq said...

I've read the book by Rebecca Brown when I was 16/17 and I remember how big an impact it has on me up til now. I was a strong Christian in my teenage years but I've since wandered away from my path with God.

Despite the way I live my life now, away from God and the Christian way, my believes in the spirits are exactly similar to yours - that they are the minions of Satan or in your term, "guardian devil". It may sound outrages to some but everybody is entitled to choose what and how they believe in something, no?

At the end of the day, when it comes to getting concrete proof on the existence of God, I believe it boils down to one's own faith. Look at it in a big picture - nearly everybody has the need to believe that there's a greater being thatn them out there.

Maxforce said...

To ahjohn,
Thanks for trying to enlighten me though I think in the context you re looking at, I am beyond redemption. Or perhaps the words of John Calvin (if I remember correctly the name) was right - Some are predestined to be saved and some not.

You said
"Seriously have you ever consider if there is life after death or you have never made any research on all religions before you become an Atheist."

Actually I did. And for 2 long years at least, if my memory didnt fail me. As said, I researched many religions, some of which you probably are unfamiliar with :P. Anyway, in the end, I realise something - no one has a damn clue! Hahahaha took me long but HEY!!! Well... no real excuse :P

You said:
"If you put all religions together, many religions are actually worshipping to a certain man/woman. I do not want to go to any religion in specific. But if you look into the history of these men, 1. they are actually great warriors or 2. someone who practice good way of living or 3. myth with non existance/proof (forms of animals or skull or cartoon character)."

Yeap, as a matter of fact, the practice of religion begun when man worship the sun, the moon, etc. But I shan't bore you with what you already know. So worship man or woman, actually the way I look at it - every religion is also the same, yours is not an exception.
The only difference is yours claim himself to be Son of God, while say Islam, Nabi Muhammad claim himself to be the Prophet of Allah. Buddha didnt claim himself to be God or otherwise. His followers made him one for honoring his good teachings etc. Hence, I always look at Buddhism as a way of life. But the nobleness of Buddhism does not suit me. Whilst I do try to practise kindness, I would never sacrifice myself or my belongings or whatever for the sake of others. Well, at least I dont think so. (Others refers to strangers. Family is family, not others - but that also depends. haha!)

You said:
"You can list all the gods together and try to check out.
Which of these men have actually proclaim that they are God? We all know the consequence of wrongly claiming that. Most of them are ppl claiming that they are, but actually they did not claim themselves to be."

Partly answered above.
Anyway have you seen the documentary whereby one cult leader claim himself to be Christ himself? Where the foretelling of the coming /return of Christ in the Bible? Well this man used that and convince many that he is indeed Christ. He convince all women in the cult to have sex with him so that they can be purified and that the blood of Christ may continue etc. and its with their husband's consent!!! And yes, I am sure both you and I are disgusted with his behaviour, irregardless of the religion one is.
Anyway, the cult stocked up weapons and ammunition and moved to a mansion. Everyone - man, woman, children were trained to handle firearms. I think it was raided by SWAT. What happen in the end was that major casualties were recorded both sides.
But in the end, a fire broke out and they refused to surrender. The cult leader ordered everyone to commit suicide by putting a gun into their mouth and boom!

Why the story? Simple.
Its one thing you and I can agree on - the cult leader is a fake.
His acts are disgusting etc.

Now, why doesnt the cult members think like us? To them, he is indeed Christ. Such is the power of faith that facts are irrelevant.

You said:
"Go do your reseach.
Give you a hint:-
John 8:24.
“Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”
now you go, interesting eh?"

Thanks, I do have a Bible at home. This isnt really the part where I like most. I prefer the David and the Goliath part. The one I hate most is whereby whats-his-name was the toy in which God and Satan made a bet to test the man's faith.

anthraxxxx said...

Given a chance, I would love to talk to my brother again and I can tell him how sorry I am. But definitely not through mun mai lol. I'd rather see him in my dreams.

Shopaholicfern said...

Eh Zewt, i dun really dare to read lah...i only catch one word here and one word there also i'm getting goosebumps dy...so so so scared now..my mom's asleep and i'm all alone here.
better go to the room and sleep too....nitey nite....

-=SiN=- said...

I've seen and experience alot of weird stuff regarding these supernatural medium, healer and exorciser. It get even crazier when one experiences it first hand.

what ever our believes are~ there are somethings that couldn't be explained through scientific means.

After all the basis of believe "Faith is a substance of believe, evidence not seen".

zewt said...

sooi2 - imagine me writing it alone in the living room.

angel - the truth can be found right next to you if you're willing to face it... are u?

Maxforce - that is some serious debate you're having there with ahjohn. well, when it comes to religion, i will have to accept your decision. indeed, it is something that have no answers... and there is a reasoning to it. maybe i shall blog about it. but at the end of the day, you will soon come to a place where you realise that some things will forever remain unanswered cos it's beyond our understanding. and the guy being tested by God is job.

whisperingshout - well, both religion had the explanation... we just have to take sides. anyway, i think it's taoist and not buddhist that believes in this thing.

kyh - well, like i said... at the end of the day, it's up to us to choose our faith and discern. not an easy thing to do though.

Rashikaps - not exactly a reader. it takes a very interesting book to capture my attention :)

Dan-yel - wow... another debate... and touch politics again? haha... dan, i must say you really are something... and i must say... watching discovery is nothing compared to the real thing. maybe one day you will be given the chance to have a taste of the real water. and i shall not get in between u and kyh :)

Maxforce said...

I have no doubt that no one has the answer and in the end its up to one's faith entirely. Hence this was why I said from the beginning - it depends on one's faith entirely :P
And also why I am beyond redemption haha.
NB: I went around asking these questions and many more asking pastors, priests etc. None could answer. Too bad I did not know any Bishops or Popes, else I would ask them too. Haha. But I really doubt anyone has the answer.
The ones who have the answer are already 6 feet underground. Looks like I would need to wait for my turn to find out. Heh heh!
If there was indeed a God out there, I ll let him do his job and show me something that I would be compelled to believe. So far, none yet, unfortunately. Maybe John Calvin was right. Hehe.
Cheers!

zewt said...

princessJournals - well, i would really like to know the islam perspective of things, one which i have yet to fully comprehend. thanks... but i think such entries will be coming to an end :)

sunshine - that's good... we should have our stand.

rachel - well... sometimes we really need to see things ourselves... which might not be a good thing. blessed are those who does not see and yet believe. ok la... just a few more hahah...

myop101 - so you read her books too. i just read one. i wonder how many you have.

Sharon - well, firstly,i cant recall what exactly he said... but remember some things turned really ugly and it may also offend other religions so...

Mcmercedez - sounds like you have a similar experience as Cole. well, i have given the explanation and that explanation is certified by a Christian elder if i remember correctly. but then again... we should only place our trust in God. let Him tell us the true way.

missironic - haha... movies of cos funny la.

zewt said...

Huei - that's true... but i believe that the person who has left is no longer here. speaking of which, i really wish i can speak to my mom again but...

The Pisces Man - nice mah... haha.

may - let's... :)

ahjohn - i will say it again... you should really be a pastor :)...interesting point on men not proclaiming that they are god. indeed... buddha never said so and yet so many worship him.

aSstHa - that is a comment where you should put up as an entry itself. really creepy... but insurance... i think that's pretty small matter, unless she has something against the husband.

Jacss - i wanted to post some of my cooking photos today but all corrupted... sigh... keep such stories coming? some scared to read AZAIG already... hehe.

Manal - hahaha... i can watch it again and again and will not get bored of it.

zewt said...

j or ji - memang, banyak perkara yang kita tak akan dapat jawab... kita hanya soal...

alan zed - indeed it is.

pablopabla - that is why i never want to go and seek to talk to my mom. i dont want to open up myself to spiritual attack.

sharlydia - eh... check my previous entries la... aha...

gracieq - hmmm... why no longer strong? i think a lot of ppl are like you... i am one of them. so passionate during our teens... then burn out.

anthraxxxx - that's a good thing...

shopaholicfern - aiyah... read it tomm ok?

-=Sin=- - maybe you can share your experience.

l y n n w e i said...

zewt, i agree with u! u've got it right!! yay!

kyh said...

I would like to clarify something here.

Buddha doesn't declare Him as God. He's a teacher, brought to Earth to bring humanity to enlightenment. Those who worship him as God just don't get the gist of Buddhism. Most of these worshipping things have been influenced by Chinese folk religions and Taoism.

We kneel in front of Buddha is not an act of worship, but a sign of gratitude and respect to Buddha for his compassionate teachings on humanity. Just like Chinese who kneel in front of their deceased family members to express their respect for him/her as well as an act of filial piety for elderly. The same thing is done by Chinese newly weds during the 'zham cha' session in traditional Chinese weddings. But this act is generally discarded as an act of worship by most Protestants.

l y n n w e i said...

kyh, it was the demon that possesed her..the guardian demon that possesed her....there are demons that live around long enough to learn about our habbits, know what we do..etc.

Maxforce said...

kyh,

You certainly know your stuff :)

ahjohn said...

Hi Maxforce:

Dont get me wrong. It is not a kind of serious debate of who win or not. Because in the end of the day, is a life won or lost. Well, at least on the brighter side, I have done my work of mine. The good news is God has not given up on anyone :)

One last thing I would say, when you ask the pastor about religion, this thing was done in a world congress before, gathering all religion in the world. you can probably do another research. All eldest leader were there.
They ask, what is the fundamental that makes your religion the true one and what has the extra bit?

Undeniable, they come to a conclusion that if you do good more than bad, you go to heaven. check out on every holy teachings of every religion. it is to do good. Yes, Christian life is the same, but with something more. We believe to go up to Heaven is by the grace of God. and that is simply to say, "I repend and I believe that Jesus Christ is the son of God".
Now, you can go back to the pastors you ask :)

Have a nice friday!

ahjohn said...

interesting fact from kyh!

"Buddha doesn't declare Him as God. He's a teacher, brought to Earth to bring humanity to enlightenment. Those who worship him as God just don't get the gist of Buddhism. Most of these worshipping things have been influenced by Chinese folk religions and Taoism."

So does it mean by you serve no god but a teaching? So what is in the prayers that you call out to? This is the first time i hear this.

sooi2 said...

hi ahjohn, from my understanding, a real buddhist doesn't pray to anyone or any god because salvation lies within one's self, and that everyone can achieve the status of nirvana (eternal peace) by freeing one's mind from worldly concerns that cause sufferings. a buddhist meditates and chants (not pray) to centralise one's concentration and thoughts.

as pointed out by kyh, majority of the buddhism practice nowadays is very much diluted and influenced by chinese culture and taoism. for example, there are beliefs that loud chants during wake and going vegetarian by the deceased's family members (zewt, no offense yeah) can help the deceased to achieve nirvana. however all these are never stated in buddha's original teaching. nirvana can only be achieved through one's self and nothing else.

kyh said...

Buddhism itself is atheistic in nature, but that doesn't make it atheism. There are no gods or a single God in Buddhism because Buddhism stresses that only we ourselves can free our souls from the pains and sufferings of the human world, just like Gautama Buddha who finally reached enlightenment after he's realized this fact. Buddhism is different from Abrahamic religions particularly in the sense that Buddhists don't rely on a Saviour or a God to reach salvation, as stated by sooi2. It works the same way as in reality. If we just keep on praying and do not work hard ourselves, we won't reap and get what we want.

Contrary to what most people believe, Gautama Buddha is not the only Buddha to have walked the Earth. According to the Pali Canon of the Theravada tradition, Siddharta Gautama is actually the 28th Buddha to be brought to this world to enlighten laymen. The reason why He's known as The Buddha is due to the fact that He's the one who established an orderly set of Buddhist teachings, spread it around India and beyond, and brought to this world what is known as Buddhism to us.

Unlike Christians and Muslims, Buddhists don't go questioning whether their faith is the ONE TRUE RELIGION or not, because to Buddhists, this matter is not important. What's important is they live a life of compassion and meditate themselves in order to prepare their ways for the enlightened state of nirvana, which is the true goal of being a Buddhist. If you're in a supposedly TRUE religion, but you don't follow fully your religion's teachings or going against it, what for? People tend to be naive that once they're in a so-called true religion, they are automatically saved from the burning fires of hell. WRONG! You'll pay for what you did in your lifetime and you can never run away from it.

If Christians believe that Jesus was born of a virgin birth and that's a miracle from God, the birth of Gautama Buddha was also a miracle in the sense that He's born from His mother's underarms, not from a womb. If Christians believe that baby Jesus spoke from His cradle, baby Buddha actually walked after he was born! He took 7 steps forward, and the steps he's taken all grew into a lotus flower each. And that's why you see lotus (which apparently is a symbol of purity) associates with Buddhism.

Einstein himself once quoted "If there's any religion that could cope with the modern scientific needs, it would be Buddhism". Buddha had actually proven the existence of microorganisms in this world when He went out with his followers one day. He was thirsty after a long walk and he used supposedly a scoop-like thing to scoop up some water from a nearby river. He then used a piece of thin cloth to filter out the water. His followers were of course curious of his actions. He explained that there were actually lifeforms in that glass of supposedly crystal clear water. That realization of the existence of microorganisms far preceded Dutchman Antonie van Leeuwenhoek's discovery of these invisible lifeforms in 1675, which was over 2000 years later.

I can't clarify things in detail as I'm still in the learning stage. A beginner's stage actually. U can try refer to Wikipedia or other reliable Buddhist sources for more information. :)

myop101 said...

i have 2 books... in the process of reading the sequel book i.e. prepare for war.

i often feel convicted each time i read her books. i feel a sense of shame because i have worldly comfort. shame on me right?

Maxforce said...

Kyh did it again, in which if I were to reply to ahjohn, I couldnt have said it better.
Not all religions are interested in saying that they are the true religion.
And of course, the way I look at this "debate" is entertainment. An exercise of the human mind, else get rusty hahaha. Serious debate? Nah.
And I do know what Christianity preaches. I attended churches and even their camps. And I must say, what you mentioned have been mentioned to death in churches and camps. And sorry, repetition doesnt work. The context you are saying is only if one believes. To a non believer, you have not and probably could not prove anything.
And its not your fault. As said - doubt anyone could anyway. Those who could, are 6 feet under. Lets be patient and find out when our turn comes. Hehe :)

Maxforce said...

What I dislike about Christianity, is that even if one lives a life of good and not evil, one cannot enter heaven if he/she did not embrace Christianity.
To which previously I asked the pastor - What about people who have never heard of Christianity?
Then he said, Well, thats why evangelism comes in, we should save these people. Anyway, Christianity is all over the world now.
I ask reorthitically (Gwad, how do you spell that) What about previously when Christianity wasnt all around the world yet?
No concrete answer were given. No citations of Bible as usual. At best, cited John Calvin for some are predestined to be saved, and some not.
I dont know... if the Lord is our father, wouldnt he want to save us all? Supposingly he did send his only son in flesh and blood to save us. But if so, why would some be predestined to be saved and some not?
And what about freedom of choice etc? If everything is predestined, I dont have to do anything right? Regardless of what I do, I will be saved. But wait. The Bible did say - God save those who save themselves.
Hmm... so John Calvin the leader of the Protestant movement was talking untruths? Half truths? Semi truths? Or which is the truth? Hmm... too much truth. Hahaha

aSstHa said...

zewt, the answer to ur question is yes.

the reason i did not put it in my blog is bcos i don't want him to know. the chances of him finding out if from my blog is like 100% but leaving it here is like 50-50... he can't go through all the entries n cant read all d comments to get to this (at least i hope so).. if not i'll prolly b in some political tangle... one way or the other.

it's interesting to read the views of kyh, ahjohn n maxforce. all of which hv come to mind before and thus, lead to me being a freethinker. i guess you decide whichever religion and that it'll b a neverending healthy debate.

-=SiN=- said...

what ever religion , teaching one may receives, ultimately it heading to "the common good" for humanity.

Of recent phrase i've been hearing lately "We human being are a spark of god" true or false? it sounds beautiful though. Time to cultivate the spiritual and harness the mystic energy XD

zewt; the weirdest experience would be.. removing exorcism through an ordinary chicken egg placed upon the body of victim..what you may find in the egg after the exorcism are bone, nail, needle , burnt talisman water, blood, fats and etc etc... it done in full view of other cure seeker.. amazing really.

pablopabla said...

Don't even think of trying it bro. You will not be talking to your mom but the evil one who is posing as your mom. Stay close to God and He will comfort you and provide you with the peace which surpasses all understanding.

zewt said...

l y n n w e i - thanks... we are of the same faith... of course! :)

kyh & ahjohn & maxforce & sooi2 - well, my mom worshipped buddha though. anyway, when it comes to faith, we can talk till the cow comes home. i shall provide my opinion in my entries... soon.

myop101 - i find some too outrages though.

aSstHa - i see... then i believe your friend had a reason to come back.

-=Sin=- - we are a spark of god? we treat ourselves so horribly... treat each other even worse... how can we even relate ourselves to god? it's truly amazing sometimes. wow... u gotta tell us about that experience in detail!!

pablopabla - thanks bro... i needed that.

B@byLor said...

:), interesting debate. :)

zewt said...

b@bylor - indeed... that's what i like about this blog.

Zaty said...

hey zewt,

in Islam too, we believe that since the satans' mission on earth is to make us stray away from our religious teachings and God, they are given by God enough power to be able to manipulate the humans' mind in whatever way.

another thing i learnt is that, everytime a baby is born, the time we enter the 'outside world' (ie. exit the womb), a minion of satan will enter our bloodstream and that is the main one that tries to lead us to do things we are prohibited from doing according to God.

this, i think, might be the 'guardian devil, one placed with (cole) since his birth to screw up his life'. and ours too.

in response to kyh's comment, Islam does not say ALL spirits are evil. princessjournals' comment will elaborate on this =)

interesting post, zewt =D

Zaty said...

in response to maxforce's statement that Islam 'worships' prophet muhammad, i verily much disagree.

prophet muhammad is just a prophet. the last one makes him more special then the rest because he is the 'most recent'. but in any case he is, at most, a man who showed us the way to live according to what is right and what is not. he is just a medium to teach, not a medium for prayers or any other form of religious practice.

thus, he is only regarded as a person to 'guide' us to the right path, not the one we pray to. the only being we worship is Allah.

of course, there are 'prophet posers' too in Islam like that ayah pin guy that fits in your descriptions of cults. 0_o now THAT is just plain weird & ridiculous.

Maxforce said...

Hmm... since when did I say that Islam worships Nabi Muhammad?
I only said that Nabi Muhammad claimed that he was the prophet of Allah.
So... there is nothing to disagree :P

zewt said...

zaty - thanks for the info about islam. it's very fascinating to know more about the other religion. interesting to know that islam does not believe all spirits are bad though.

maxforce - he claimed he was the ONLY prophet.... i think.

kyh said...

Muhammad did not claim he is the ONLY prophet. This is so wrong in Islam. There are many prophets (nabi) sent by Allah over a course of time, from the very first (Adam) to the last and the most revered (Muhammad). Muhammad is more special among all prophets because he's the one who brought the complete revelation of God to mankind, which is Islam. Al-Quran is regarded as the complete version of a series of divine revelations, from Torah to the Gospels, which are deemed corrupted by mankind overtime in their current versions.

zewt said...

kyh - your knowledge on religion impresses me... not being sarcastic here